MIDI notes don't play reliably, etc.

I’ve filed this in mantis. MIDI notes do not play reliably. I was perfectly willing to just hang in there, but…

You simply do not tell paying customers “I got stuff going on, and I have no plans to fix the show-stopping bug you reported.” It’s bad for business. That attitude has caused me to cancel my subscription. I’m still willing to pay $1 to upgrade as new versions are released, but that’s it. If you change your business approach, I’d be happy to start up a subscription again. Ardour is great. But you need to learn how to talk to customers. You can think whatever you want. You can even do whatever you want. But you can’t blurt out to customers whatever is on your mind. You need to tell paying customers “I’m sorry to hear that. I will do what I can to fix it.” Anything else, and the customer gets mad at you, and rightfully so.

So there you are.

I deliberately try to run this project without bullshit. It if it a showstopper for you that I admit that there are other developmental priorities than what a particular customer views as the most critical, then you will need find another DAW project that is willing to soothe your soul with words about “We’ll look into it” even if they have no intention of doing so of doing so at any point in the foreseeable future. Most of our user base appreciates the honesty, or so I’d like to think. If you’d prefer to talk with a customer support professional who has no actual control or input into what developers actually do, I am sure that Apple or Digidesign will be very pleased to take your call. Ardour doesn’t work that way.

By almost any standards except my own, my approach has built a remarkable success within the open source world. I am sorry that you don’t find it to your taste, but tastes differ, and this project follows mine.

I agree with paul,

alot of the time when you go through customer services, that “im sorry to hear” is all bullshit its what they are told to say.

And i dont believe it makes things any better, it just gives the customer more reason to think they are right, and the customer is always right has gone on too far…

midi is not a priority for ardour,

MIDI is a priority for us.

But we have very limited developer resources, and right now I am involved in a task that has been paid for and needs to be completed. When the sum total of Ardour users’ financial support is significantly less than the amount that a single company will pay to get development carried out, it isn’t suprising that some of the time (not all the time, just some of the time) the paid-for priorities of such a company will eclipse the needs of users.

If user financial support made it feasible to tell 3rd party companies that we’re too busy working on user priorities, and that we can’t work on their issues right now, I’d be willing to do that. But given that user financial support doesn’t even generate one US programmer salary, development priorities are not always going to follow the path that users might like, even if we certainly hope to get there in the end.

2 points of view here :
*“OP”, as devs says sometimes, who think that given a little money - on a voluntary basis, you never get bill or tax-free-sheet for it - gives him the right of decision for the project developments
*“primary dev”, as he really is, who decides where he lead the project, and sometimes might appears to “talk crude” -maybe to save time?-

Personally, I appreciate the opportunity to “talk personaly” with Paul about Ardour2-3-4, and sometimes have to live with… you know… bad taste when you’re not in phase or impatient!!
Freedom always have a price, sometimes you spend hours of your time for nothing… Sometimes you get a nice DAW+personal help for (almost) nothing…
It’s up to you, to make your choice, and at least understand the rules (& who makes it) of the backyard where you intend to “play”…

Sorry for bad english am better in my native language :wink:

off topic
Lucille is crying, he’s gone & we’re sad, rest in Peace mister King.
off topic

what is a US programmer salary?


Depends, particularly on who you ask. But around $60kUSD is the lower median I see, with others citing closer to $80kUSD. Note that is Median, for good skilled programmers with experience and in demand you are looking more in the $80k and up range. Of course this is based off a combination of memory and a quick google search, so I encourage people to fact check this:)


Thanks for the as usual quick reply Seablade; this allows to think about the month goal up&right here… and maybe more about society, freedom and money illness VS happiness?


You will notice that the amount that Paul targets for monthly income is nowhere close to any of the numbers I mentioned above:)


I should also note in the US, you would get that pay, along with benefits (Vacation, Sick Leave, Health/Dental/Vision Insurance, etc.) So between pay and benefits, as well as the associated payroll taxes that get added on top, what a company actually pays is significantly more than the numbers I mentioned above as well (By at least 25%) for a good programmer.


Please note that the troll mode is OFF

Thanks for the statistics upon programmer salary Seablade, let say $100k/year with benefits include for a good programmer.
People can now compare with Ardour incoming, at the right top of the pages in the site.

Some reflexions, based on the fact that we all agree that Paul is a good programmer :
-Ardour income is not a reflect of “the market”, but is this notion of market something good for human kind?
-most of us here, at least the many of us here; doesn’t get $50k/y (not sure that we even need it…)
-Ardour users proves that it’s possible to build something different than the “classic business model”
-most of us here are really happy that Paul can live this freedom

And yes, as LeatusPenguin said, most of customers service providers are non-sense bullshiters & never help, their operators are only here to read the text they have under the eyes, and most of them doesn’t care about your issue. That is typical of a communication society, where words are more important than acts, and tends to not reflect they…

I 100% agree with the point of view expressed here, Mantis way of doing is preferable & less frustrating, even if it’s not perfect & most of the times needs you to put a lot of patience in its process!!

-Ardour income is not a reflect of "the market", but is this notion of market something good for human kind? -most of us here, at least the many of us here; doesn't get $50k/y (not sure that we even need it..)

Yes but this gets into a discussion on global economics that would take quite a while to figure out. The extent I will touch on it is that the numbers that Paul requests for monthly income is based less on being a programmer, and much more on the cost to raise a family where he is. And honestly, I am a bit surprised they aren’t higher, as I am in an area with a lower cost of living than Paul and can safely say that that wouldn’t be much for a family to live on here. Possible certainly, but not the easiest and certainly not the best.


----that would take quite a while to figure out----

hey; a while isn’t JUST the thing we need , honey?)))