Hello Ardour folks!
AV Linux and MX Moksha 25 have been simultaneously released! Get the full scoop in my Blog post and on the renovated AVL and MXM websites here:
Blog post: AV Linux and MX Moksha 25 Released!
AVL site: AV Linux MX Edition
MXM site: MX Moksha
Best to all and Happy Thanksgiving to our American brothers and sisters!
Glen
Great. I was planning to install new version of AV Linux on my take-it-everywhere-and-break-it -if-you-must laptop these days as soon as i manage to catch a breath, so i was very curious when itāll appear.
Iām kinda sad that the original image will not contain Ardour 9, but hey, whatahell.
Cool, thanks Glen.
One quick question for Glen.
Have you ever tried using remote control mixing applications for live mixers like Midas M,MR, Behringer X,XR and Wing series (occasionally A&H Qu) with AVLinux? I suspect itās not going to be the problem (since they offer linux versions of their applications) but stillā¦any experience? Very often i end up doing live sound for some band so i kinda need this. Howās support for different wi-fi routers, lan etc.
?
Hi, thanks so much for your interest in the project!
TBH I have never used AVL with these product-specific applications so I canāt give specific advice. AVL uses āConnmanā for internet connections so it does differ from Distros that use the more common Network Manager, whether this is a pro or a con I canāt sayā¦ In my experience WiFi has worked as expected but this has only been in my own home or in the Studio. There are not many reports of trouble in this regard so I would hope things would be successful.
On the subject of WiFi, the Enlightenment Desktop Environment provides an extremely simple frontend for Connman, I do provide a more detailed frontend called āConnman UI Setupā and it can be found in the āInternetā menuā¦
Just instaled AVL 25.
Well, the GUI and offline functionality for x-air edit is there.
Will test it out in near future.
Good sign 
Distro seems cool as always, plug-in selection is awesome, but ā¦
ā¦something is up here, iām kind of running in circles
Somethingās not right with audio playback and proc usage when using Ardour.
Iām guessing itās me not being familiar with pipewire (in older versions of AV Linux i was using
straight up Jack, and used to set it up with QJackCtl.
Hereās whatās happening. Iām just trying to mess with midi and audio (no real need for 0 latency monitoring/recording) in Ardour using this laptop so i can preview-mix using internal audio device and headphones, but the playback is choppy even on highest buffer settings in both cases - using pipewire/jack or alsa. Just one instance of LSP plugin (say Multiband Compessor) can eat up to 80% of processor. Drum Locker (installed to try it with their 70s Drums) playback is choppy even when i turn on just some dynamic processing or reverb in it.
Now, this is not state of the art Laptop, but it aint that bad i guess . Where talking of Fujitsu Lifebook E746, i5-6300U, Integrated Intel HD 520 Graphics, and 8GB of ram.
Now, using Win on the same laptop i pull up bunch of processing on every track + on groups + on master and it just plays, no fuss. So, iām guessing itās something iām missing with audio settings in AV Linux or something else i didnāt grasp yetā¦
Any Ideas?
Also, thereās this probem with LSP GUIās wich tend to be larger than this laptops screen (screen resolution is just 1366x768ā¦yeahā¦i know that sucks). Some of those, mainly larger GUIās just crash, or are just unresponsive, so i have to kill that process using Evisum). Is there any way to adjust these plugs GUIās to fit normaly?
Ah yes, i tried it also with iRigUA wich is always in my backpocket, but the problem remains the same (not that i like that āinferfaceā, i actualy think it sucks, but i bought it one occasion while traveling in Germany, so i kept it for quick idea capturing).
I also have steinberg ur22mkII, m-audio 2496, and m-audio delta 1010 rack unit but i use those on different, desktop computers, so i didnāt get the chance to try it yet.
The LSP plugins have a setting to change ui scaling in the menu of each one.
Sorry to hear you are having issues, to be clear you have the same problems when using PipeWire and ALSA backends? I will let you in on a scandalous secret; I have personally not used JACK or PipeWire for production for many yearsā¦ 
. I make an effort to do the usual Linux Audio performance tweaks and of course before I release AV Linux I make sure that pipewire-jack is linked to libjack so applications wanting to connect to JACK find PipeWire automatically and I make sure in a live session that Ardour transport ājust worksā when Ardour runs out of the box. I also supply a few known-to-work Ardour udev rules. Beyond that I just add Debianās stock PipeWire Repo packages and as of AVL-25 I provide āCableā or my own 'PipeWire tools for PipeWire tweaking.
Your machine has plenty of processing power and RAM especially for Enlightenment, thatās not the issue although I would agree the screen resolution is below the unspoken minimum but not much can be done about thatā¦ So what are some things we could look atā¦ An unlikely cause is that Enlightenment is using itās software compositing which normally isnāt noticeable but on some systems Iāve seen it affect performance in rare cases. Have a look in Menuā>Settingsā>Settings Panelā>Compositorā>Advancedā>Rendering tab. If your Video card will support it you want āOpenGLā selected.
I understand that Windows is performing without issues but if the system is not sharing vital IRQās with Windows (or another Linux) installed there is always the possibility that this system with AVL installed is sharing IRQās and that can just be luck of the draw. You can have a look at the system IRQās and see if your Audio device is sharing an IRQ by pasting this command into a terminal;
cat /proc/interrupts | awk '{print $1, $NF}'
If anyone else is noticing unusual performance issues please let me know, it would be nice to know if this issue is specific to this hardware or a wider issueā¦
Yes, audio playback problem remains with alsa, and also pipewire/jack backend.
I noticed that audio works okayish using pulseaudio backend,
but, that being said, i have to raise the buffer all the way up to 8192 samples (which i canāt do with
alsa or pipewire/jack). But then the animated graphic side (metering etc) in Ardour becomes very slugish, chopped up.
Composite settings/Rendering tab is adjusted the way you descibed it.
Also, the problem with LSP plugins is definitely on the GUI side of things, cause, if i only insert it and use
the plugin with generic UI, everythingās else work as usual, and procesor usage is optimal. But as soon as i start up its real LSP GUI, whole Ardour becomes unresponsive, procesor usage skyrocket, so i have to kill the process. Other plugins seem to work fine, just LSP ones donāt, and itās definitely something to do with GUI.
Hereās what terminal said:
$ cat /proc/interrupts | awk ā{print $1, $NF}ā
CPU0 CPU3
0: timer
1: i8042
8: rtc0
9: acpi
12: i8042
16: i801_smbus
120: bwctrl
121: bwctrl
122: bwctrl
123: ahci[0000:00:17.0]
124: xhci_hcd
125: eth0
126: mmc0
127: i915
128: mei_me
129: iwlwifi
130: snd_hda_intel:card0
NMI: interrupts
LOC: interrupts
SPU: interrupts
PMI: interrupts
IWI: interrupts
RTR: retries
RES: interrupts
CAL: interrupts
TLB: shootdowns
TRM: interrupts
THR: interrupts
DFR: interrupts
MCE: exceptions
MCP: polls
ERR: 0
MIS: 0
PIN: event
NPI: event
PIW: event
PMN: event
Okay, news .
Itās weird. I think that problem is not the backend per se.
I managed to set the Pipewire buffer (quantum) in āCableā to 8192 samples,
and then the audio choppynes in Ardour when using Pipewire/Jack went away.
Same behavior is with Pulseaudio when i set the buffer to 8192.
Alsa doesnāt allow buffer to be set that high anywhere i looked, so audio in Ardour remains choppy even with 4096 samples buffer(highes allowed option with alsa backend).
But raising audio buffer that high is weird.
Also, animated graphics in ardour becomes choppy with audio buffer that high, but i remember i read somewhere that it is itās normal behaviour in that case.
Problem with LSP plugins GUIās remains. Other plugins seem to work normal as far as iāve tested.
New development.
I think i nailed the screwy audio playback thing.
Might be a false alarm.
Last night, at about three in the morning I realized i was testing the playback with the one particular instrument always present - Audio Assaultās Drum Locker 70ā Drums. So i turned off itās internal effects and - voila. Suddenly I was able to lower the buffer to 2048 and add bunch of other stuff like Vitalium, Yoshimi etc and everything workedā¦
ā¦until LSP GUI . Still no luck with thatā¦
EDIT: Yes, i just tested audio/buffer/dsp for about 40 minutes, creating some loop using Dumlabooh, Obxd, Yoshimi and bunch of effects. Everything works just fine at 2048 samples buffer. Audio glitching and stuttering was definetely caused by internal Drum Locker effects.
Just need to find a solution for graphic adapter/openGL version/LSP plugins GUI problem - i think itās connected. My suspition is that i need to find the right driver who will seamlesly support OpenGL with this GPU. While messing around and switching to Intelās GPU driver, after reboot i got this message:
Hi,
Sorry, I got busy upgrading my build system to AVL-25 and didnāt get back to this. That warning does seem to indicate that there may be on OpenGL version issue, it appears Enlightenment has switched to itās software compositing and as long as that works and if youāre getting better performance that way then the compositor was likely not the bottleneck. 2048 is still not great but 8192 should never be necessaryā¦ As far as LSP they also donāt work when switched from OpenGL to Cairo?
Even though your machine has decent enough specs the OpenGL thing is baffling me, I wonder the Kernel and Mesa Video drivers are too new for that particular Intel Graphics chipā¦?
Laggy audio was definitely caused by Audio Assaultās Drum Locker internal FX. That I realised while still using standard GPU driver provided with AV Linux with compositor set to OpenGl. I think itās not related to gpu/open GPL problem. Yeah, 2048 buffer is kinda high, but not uncommon with these integrated sound chips in 20ish-something tracks projects with processing and heavy virtual instruments all around, so, once i saw it work with 2048 buffer as expected, I didnāt even test it with lower buffer. I will, as soon possible but Iām pretty sure itās gonna be ok.
When I saw audio playback work, then I started tinkering with different GPU drivers to try to resolve LSP GUI issue. Installed a few different driver options using MX Package Installer. Also, somewhere in the system settings (donāt remember where right now out of my head ) i thicked on the āuse intel driverā box.
Got that message i posted after one of the reboots while changing drivers.
LSP GUI problem, unlike audio playback problem, most likely is somehow connected to GPU driver/OpenGl version. Audio side of LSP plugins works normally, without seriously affecting CPU performance(tried it successfully a couple of times with generic Ardour plugins UI). As soon as i catch some free time, I will investigate it further, and Iāll get back what I found out here.
Thanks Glen, cheers!
Problems solvedā¦kind of .
LSP GUI - After tinkering for hours with opengl vs software rendering, Mesa vs Intel drivers, and searching for right info about Intel HD 520 OpenGL version support, i just tought to myself: āLetās see when did LSP introduce OpenGL supportāā¦turns out, not that long ago. So i just downloaded LSP plugin pack version 1.2.1 (older) - and those just work without issues. Guiās responsive, processor behaves normaly.
Glitchy audio - no real problems there. It was all caused by weird behaviour of internal FX in Drum Locker. I tested it for few hours and audio works good with 512 samples buffer, reducing latency to about 10ms. All good as far as i can see.
Once again, thanks Glen!
(ā¦it rhymes, man : ) )
Have you tried to switch to Cairo when using LSP?
I would not recommend to use 1.2.1 version since there were already many changes, bugfixes and new plugins implemented in recent version.
To switch from OpenGL to Cairo, you need to set up the LSP_WS_LIB_GLXSURFACE=off environment variable and restart user session. In the About dialog you should see āCairoā instead of āOpenGLā.
I will try it tomorrow first available time, and iāll let you know how it went.
Wellā¦hereās whatās happening.
Iāve set the enviroment variable by editing the .bashrc file using export command.
Saved it, rebooted, checked if itās off using terminal and printenv command and i got:
$ printenv
SHELL=/bin/bash
WINDOWID=18874403
QT_ACCESSIBILITY=1
XDG_CONFIG_DIRS=/usr/etc/xdg:/etc/xdg
E_CONF_PROFILE=standard
XDG_SESSION_PATH=/org/freedesktop/DisplayManager/Session0
XDG_MENU_PREFIX=e-
E_RESTART=1
TERM_PROGRAM_VERSION=1.14.0
E_TAINTED=NO
FREETYPE_PROPERTIES=truetype:interpreter-version=35
QT_LOGGING_RULES=qt.qpa.xcb.warning=false
SSH_AUTH_SOCK=/tmp/ssh-RT9aUlrClybe/agent.1941
E_LIB_DIR=/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu
E_ICON_THEME=gnome
E_IPC_SOCKET=/run/user/1000/e-ljuba@0/2015
DESKTOP_SESSION=lightdm-xsession
SSH_AGENT_PID=2014
XDG_SEAT=seat0
PWD=/home/ljuba
XDG_SESSION_DESKTOP=lightdm-xsession
LOGNAME=ljuba
QT_QPA_PLATFORMTHEME=gtk2
E_START_MANAGER=1
XDG_SESSION_TYPE=x11
GPG_AGENT_INFO=/run/user/1000/gnupg/S.gpg-agent:0:1
XAUTHORITY=/home/ljuba/.Xauthority
DESKTOP_STARTUP_ID=E_START|481
E_DESKLOCK_LOCKED=
E_SCALE=1.000
XDG_GREETER_DATA_DIR=/var/lib/lightdm/data/ljuba
QT_STYLE_OVERRIDE=gtk2
GDM_LANG=en_GB.utf8
HOME=/home/ljuba
SSH_ASKPASS=/usr/bin/enlightenment_askpass
LANG=en_GB.UTF-8
LS_COLORS=rs=0:di=01;34:ln=01;36:mh=00:pi=40;33:so=01;35:do=01;35:bd=40;33;01:cd=40;33;01:or=40;31;01:mi=00:su=37;41:sg=30;43:ca=00:tw=30;42:ow=34;42:st=37;44:ex=01;32:.7z=01;31:.ace=01;31:.alz=01;31:.apk=01;31:.arc=01;31:.arj=01;31:.bz=01;31:.bz2=01;31:.cab=01;31:.cpio=01;31:.crate=01;31:.deb=01;31:.drpm=01;31:.dwm=01;31:.dz=01;31:.ear=01;31:.egg=01;31:.esd=01;31:.gz=01;31:.jar=01;31:.lha=01;31:.lrz=01;31:.lz=01;31:.lz4=01;31:.lzh=01;31:.lzma=01;31:.lzo=01;31:.pyz=01;31:.rar=01;31:.rpm=01;31:.rz=01;31:.sar=01;31:.swm=01;31:.t7z=01;31:.tar=01;31:.taz=01;31:.tbz=01;31:.tbz2=01;31:.tgz=01;31:.tlz=01;31:.txz=01;31:.tz=01;31:.tzo=01;31:.tzst=01;31:.udeb=01;31:.war=01;31:.whl=01;31:.wim=01;31:.xz=01;31:.z=01;31:.zip=01;31:.zoo=01;31:.zst=01;31:.avif=01;35:.jpg=01;35:.jpeg=01;35:.jxl=01;35:.mjpg=01;35:.mjpeg=01;35:.gif=01;35:.bmp=01;35:.pbm=01;35:.pgm=01;35:.ppm=01;35:.tga=01;35:.xbm=01;35:.xpm=01;35:.tif=01;35:.tiff=01;35:.png=01;35:.svg=01;35:.svgz=01;35:.mng=01;35:.pcx=01;35:.mov=01;35:.mpg=01;35:.mpeg=01;35:.m2v=01;35:.mkv=01;35:.webm=01;35:.webp=01;35:.ogm=01;35:.mp4=01;35:.m4v=01;35:.mp4v=01;35:.vob=01;35:.qt=01;35:.nuv=01;35:.wmv=01;35:.asf=01;35:.rm=01;35:.rmvb=01;35:.flc=01;35:.avi=01;35:.fli=01;35:.flv=01;35:.gl=01;35:.dl=01;35:.xcf=01;35:.xwd=01;35:.yuv=01;35:.cgm=01;35:.emf=01;35:.ogv=01;35:.ogx=01;35:.aac=00;36:.au=00;36:.flac=00;36:.m4a=00;36:.mid=00;36:.midi=00;36:.mka=00;36:.mp3=00;36:.mpc=00;36:.ogg=00;36:.ra=00;36:.wav=00;36:.oga=00;36:.opus=00;36:.spx=00;36:.xspf=00;36:~=00;90:#=00;90:.bak=00;90:.crdownload=00;90:.dpkg-dist=00;90:.dpkg-new=00;90:.dpkg-old=00;90:.dpkg-tmp=00;90:.old=00;90:.orig=00;90:.part=00;90:.rej=00;90:.rpmnew=00;90:.rpmorig=00;90:.rpmsave=00;90:.swp=00;90:.tmp=00;90:.ucf-dist=00;90:.ucf-new=00;90:*.ucf-old=00;90:
XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=Enlightenment
LSP_WS_LIB_GLXSURFACE=off
XDG_SEAT_PATH=/org/freedesktop/DisplayManager/Seat0
PANTS=ON
XTERM_256_COLORS=1
TERMINOLOGY=1
E_START=x-window-manager
E_PREFIX=/usr
XDG_SESSION_CLASS=user
TERM=xterm-256color
USER=ljuba
E_DATA_DIR=/usr/share/enlightenment
SUDO_ASKPASS=/usr/bin/enlightenment_askpass
DISPLAY=:0.0
SHLVL=1
XDG_VTNR=7
DESKTOP=Enlightenment
XDG_SESSION_ID=2
XDG_RUNTIME_DIR=/run/user/1000
E_HOME_DIR=/home/ljuba/.e/e
E_BIN_DIR=/usr/bin
XDG_DATA_DIRS=/usr/share/enlightenment:/home/ljuba/.local/share/flatpak/exports/share:/var/lib/flatpak/exports/share:/usr/local/share:/usr/share
EMIX_SINK_ICONS=/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/enlightenment/modules/mixer/sink-icons.txt
PATH=/home/ljuba/.local/bin:/home/ljuba/Applications/.bin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/local/games:/usr/games:/sbin:/usr/sbin
GDMSESSION=lightdm-xsession
DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS=unix:path=/run/user/1000/bus
EVAS_GL_RENDER_DISABLE_DITHER=1
E_LOCALE_DIR=/usr/share/locale
TERM_PROGRAM=terminology
_=/usr/bin/printenv
So, as you can see, in the about middle of terminalās response , variable seems to be realy set to " off ".
But, still, when iām in Ardour and i pull up an LSP plugin, and go to About page:
Any idea why?
@Ljuba thatās very strange. Just checked from console on some debug build of Ardour:
export LSP_WS_LIB_GLXSURFACE=off
/opt/Ardour-8.6.365/bin/ardour8
Then I open/create session, put LV2 plugin to the track/bus and launch the About dialog. It shows āCairoā.
If I run then:
export LSP_WS_LIB_GLXSURFACE=on
/opt/Ardour-8.6.365/bin/ardour8
It switches back to OpenGL.
Arenāt you using SNAP or some other āmodernā package managers?
Is is possible for you to try my approach?
Hi,
It is not a snap (hell no!!). Ardour in AV Linux is the official bundle wrapped in a Debian Package, so the executable is here:
/opt/ARDOUR-8/bin/ardour8
I also tried changing the environment variable in the Desktop Environment itself but I also get OpenGL in LSP āAboutā when I run Ardour. I will try further and post back later.